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Next: PowerPoint 2008 corrupts slide sorter of all Powe..
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Since: Jan 19, 2008
Posts: 74
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(Msg. 16) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 4:06 pm
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: microsoft>public>mac>office>word (more info?)
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In article ,
John McGhie wrote:
> No Cigar! You have to change MY bad habits, not Word's :-)
>
Ah, but that's where wecompletely disagree. The app should be shaped to
our demands, not the other way around.
--
"It's very hard to be a gentleman and a writer."
W. Somerset Maugham |
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External
Since: May 22, 2004
Posts: 1465
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(Msg. 17) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 7:15 pm
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Nah... You're getting circular here :-)
I assume you understand Styles and Inheritance?
Normal style is "Style 0". Everything inherits from Normal by default. You
can (and for professional work, you 'should'...) break the inheritance up
into chains, as explained in Clive's Bend Word book.
If you do, you can then set Normal to zero leading if you wish, and obtain
exactly the function you desire, without screwing up the themes and document
parts.
Mac Word is designed for absolute newbies to produce DTP-like Church
Newsletters. The bit of the design that was intended for document
professionals is hidden below the first layer of the user interface.
If you wish, you can customise Word within an inch of its life, and you
should. The 'feature' that makes it far and away the most powerful word
processor in the world, is that customisability. You can build exactly the
tool you want, to do precisely the job you do, in exactly the way you work.
No other application comes close.
Admittedly, Microsoft has broken a lot of that in this release, which is
very much a rush job. But presumably they don't intend to leave it like
this. I hope not, for their sake... It's dead in the water the way it is
now.
But unless your forte IS church newsletters, you have to take the thing by
the horns and bend it to your will. If you don't, you have wasted your
money buying it. The best power tools in the shop won't help if they're all
left hanging on the wall in the garage :-)
If you want a product that comes out of the box designed to do your job,
keep looking. Microsoft Office ain't it. Such a product would be in the
$15,000 a copy range, because Microsoft would have to do all the work.
But this product is designed so that you can customise it exactly for your
purposes. If you wish to do that, stay tuned and we'll show you how.
You'll get exactly what you want, and have enough money left over to fund
your other bad habits.
Cheers
On 9/02/08 10:59 PM, in article
copespaz-031ABA.06595509022008.TakeThisOut@sn-radius.vsrv-sjc.supernews.net, "MC"
wrote:
> In article ,
> John McGhie wrote:
>
>> No Cigar! You have to change MY bad habits, not Word's :-)
>>
>
> Ah, but that's where wecompletely disagree. The app should be shaped to
> our demands, not the other way around.
--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/
Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.
John McGhie, Consultant Technical Writer
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
http://jgmcghie.fastmail.com.au/
Sydney, Australia. S33°53'34.20 E151°14'54.50
+61 4 1209 1410, mailto:john@mcghie.name |
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External
Since: Jan 19, 2008
Posts: 74
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(Msg. 18) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 7:15 pm
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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In article ,
John McGhie wrote:
> Nah... You're getting circular here :-)
>
> I assume you understand Styles and Inheritance?
>
> Normal style is "Style 0". Everything inherits from Normal by default. You
> can (and for professional work, you 'should'...) break the inheritance up
> into chains, as explained in Clive's Bend Word book.
<SNIP>
Actually we agree. I customize Wordto my needs, and you customize it to
yours.
However we *should* be able to customize it to allow us to correct our
bad habits quietly in the background, but we can't, apparently, do that
for all our bad habits.
There is a program that (I believe) was originally based on Word Mac
(when it was called ScriptThing) called Movie Magic Screenwriter 2000 --
and that has a preference that allows you to choose automatic single
spaces or double spaces at the end of sentences. So if you select
Single, you can enter two spaces to your heart's content and get a
single space in the document-- and vice versa. If they can do it, why
can't Word?
Just one example of several that I can think of, but don't have the time
or energy to enumerate.
--
"It's very hard to be a gentleman and a writer."
W. Somerset Maugham >> Stay informed about: single line spacing |
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External
Since: Oct 04, 2004
Posts: 1410
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(Msg. 19) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 7:39 pm
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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MC wrote:
> Just one example of several that I can think of, but don't have the time
> or energy to enumerate.
>
For every example you can think of, there are other people who would
want something else, or would put a greater priority on Word helping
with a different bad habit. The designers have to juggle all that, plus
what's feasible in the code, plus the need to keep the program actually
usable and minimize its strong tendency to overwhelm. Plus whatever the
official thinking is on software usability.
> So if you select
> Single, you can enter two spaces to your heart's content and get a
> single space in the document-- and vice versa. If they can do it, why
> can't Word?
>
Dreamweaver does that also. Many web-focused programs will ignore you
typing multiple spaces. I can imagine the howls if Word took away the
ability to type multiple spaces in a row, or hid it in a preference.
I've used input managers that don't use punctuation and space as a
trigger for auto-correcting (or I think I have, not sure). They act very
strangely on my machine. Not correcting space-space is a small price to
pay for a generally excellent implementation of AutoCorrect, in my opinion.
By the way, you can tell Spelling and Grammar to flag two spaces as an
error, and then it will correct your bad habit when you run grammar
check. Plus you can Find and Replace, as mentioned before.
You can Help | Send Feedback, but I'd consider this really low priority,
myself--it would mean changing the basic code in AutoCorrect, when there
are already two workarounds to handle the same issue. Much better uses
of developer time.
Daiya >> Stay informed about: single line spacing |
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External
Since: Dec 10, 2005
Posts: 20
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(Msg. 20) Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 3:23 pm
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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In article ,
Daiya Mitchell wrote:
> By the way, you can tell Spelling and Grammar to flag two spaces as an
> error, and then it will correct your bad habit when you run grammar
> check.
Apparently that is the default in 2008. (At least it seems to be in
mine.)
Charles >> Stay informed about: single line spacing |
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External
Since: Feb 17, 2008
Posts: 2
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(Msg. 21) Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2008 3:08 am
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Hi all,
I have the same single line spacing problem described at the beginning of this discussion, but Daiya's advice:
"To change in just this document, select all, go to Format | Paragraph. Look down to the find the Spacing: After field, and change 10 to 0"
is not relevant in my case because my settings are already 0 pt spacing before and after.
Any other ideas?
Lanks >> Stay informed about: single line spacing |
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External
Since: Jul 20, 2005
Posts: 1164
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(Msg. 22) Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2008 8:43 am
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Then evidently you *don't* have the "same problem" - if you did it would be
fixed by the "same solution" :-)
In order to help out we'll need to know more about:
A) Your version of Word
B) Your version of OS X
C) Your type of Mac
D) A more detailed description of your problem
Use the Show/Hide button (¶) on your toolbar to see what kind of
non-printing characters display where - especially between the paras. Also
try clicking in just 1 para that exhibits the extra space beneath it & check
the Spacing Before/After - it could be that you have different settings on
different paras which could cause a false reading when you Select All.
HTH |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac
On 2/17/08 6:08 AM, in article ee8c915.20.DeleteThis@webcrossing.caR9absDaxw,
"lanks@officeformac.com" wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I have the same single line spacing problem described at the beginning of this
> discussion, but Daiya's advice:
>
> "To change in just this document, select all, go to Format | Paragraph. Look
> down to the find the Spacing: After field, and change 10 to 0"
>
> is not relevant in my case because my settings are already 0 pt spacing before
> and after.
> Any other ideas?
>
> Lanks >> Stay informed about: single line spacing |
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External
Since: Oct 04, 2004
Posts: 1410
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(Msg. 23) Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2008 9:24 am
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Then you don't have the same problem. :)
Can you explain clearly what you do, what happens, and what you want to
happen instead?
lanks.TakeThisOut@officeformac.com wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I have the same single line spacing problem described at the beginning of this discussion, but Daiya's advice:
>
> "To change in just this document, select all, go to Format | Paragraph. Look down to the find the Spacing: After field, and change 10 to 0"
>
> is not relevant in my case because my settings are already 0 pt spacing before and after.
> Any other ideas?
>
> Lanks
> >> Stay informed about: single line spacing |
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External
Since: Feb 17, 2008
Posts: 2
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(Msg. 24) Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 3:00 am
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Hi guys,
Thanks for the responses (and the grammar lesson;)
I have actually managed to solve this issue by opening a 'new' document, copying the 'problem' text, pasting it into the new file and saving the document under a different name. Voilá, line spacing returned to the format setting: single.
So unless you really want to solve this one further, I'm happy to accept that there may have been some corruption in the file (it was a bastardised file from a PC version of Word). But the symptoms were as detailed in the opening thread by 'framfrog', as well as several other posts I have read. I'm running Office 2004 for mac on a MacBook Pro with OS X 10.5.1. I opened an old Word file, and the spacing between paragraphs appeared to be greater than one line, despite format settings set to single spacing. I didn't know which to curse, Microsoft or Apple.
Thanks again for your prompt replies. As a mac newbie, I am meeting a couple of 'transition challenges', but I have found the mac user community to be excellent. >> Stay informed about: single line spacing |
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External
Since: Oct 04, 2004
Posts: 1410
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(Msg. 25) Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 8:07 am
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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I'd go with corruption, especially considering the way you fixed
it--paste into a new doc is one of the standard fixes, others here, just
FYI:
http://word.mvps.org/Mac/DocumentCorruption.html
Also, the problem in the original post (although framfrog didn't mention
it, I just guessed because dozens of others had the same problem)
occurred upon creating new documents, not opening old ones. That's
enough to make it not the same problem. :-) Incidentally, that's a
lesson in analysis or possibly logic, rather than grammar . :) (Sorry,
I'm a teacher--can't help it)
Thanks for the update--it'll likely help someone else later, especially
as that's not a familiar sign of corruption.
lanks.DeleteThis@officeformac.com wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> Thanks for the responses (and the grammar lesson;)
>
> I have actually managed to solve this issue by opening a 'new' document, copying the 'problem' text, pasting it into the new file and saving the document under a different name. Voilá, line spacing returned to the format setting: single.
>
> So unless you really want to solve this one further, I'm happy to accept that there may have been some corruption in the file (it was a bastardised file from a PC version of Word). But the symptoms were as detailed in the opening thread by 'framfrog', as well as several other posts I have read. I'm running Office 2004 for mac on a MacBook Pro with OS X 10.5.1. I opened an old Word file, and the spacing between paragraphs appeared to be greater than one line, despite format settings set to single spacing. I didn't know which to curse, Microsoft or Apple.
>
> Thanks again for your prompt replies. As a mac newbie, I am meeting a couple of 'transition challenges', but I have found the mac user community to be excellent.
> >> Stay informed about: single line spacing |
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External
Since: Jan 31, 2008
Posts: 3
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(Msg. 26) Posted: Sun Feb 24, 2008 11:54 am
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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External
Since: May 22, 2004
Posts: 1465
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(Msg. 27) Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 10:33 am
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Follow the instructions Daiya sent you to in the post above yours :-)
On 25/02/08 5:24 AM, in article ee8c915.25.DeleteThis@webcrossing.caR9absDaxw, "John"
<John> wrote:
> Nothing helps me.
>
> Every time I hit enter, I get 1.5 spacing. Every time. HELP!
--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/
Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.
John McGhie, Consultant Technical Writer
+61 4 1209 1410, mailto:john@mcghie.name
McGhie Information Engineering Pty Ltd
http://jgmcghie.fastmail.com.au/
Nhulunbuy, Northern Territory, Australia >> Stay informed about: single line spacing |
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External
Since: Feb 04, 2004
Posts: 561
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(Msg. 28) Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 8:12 pm
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On 25/2/08 9:55 PM, in article C3E8D4BE.114A3%john@mcghie.name, "John
McGhie" wrote:
I know that when someone has been used to using Word as a typewriter for a
long time, Word 2008's imposition of 10 points of leading ("ledding") after
a paragraph must be annoying and all they want is an immediate solution --
especially if all they type is short letters and memos.
However, for longer documents there are huge advantages to having leading
above or below paragraphs. For example, if you want to squeeze some
paragraphs up to fit some text on a page rather than have it spill overleaf,
it's *very* easy to do it by modifying the leading -- e.g. via the Paragraph
command. Also, headings automatically "glue" themselves to following text,
so you don't have to manually adjust formatting when the document is
completed.
For occasions when you have to avoid leading, such as address blocks in
correspondence, you simply key Shift-Return instead of Return at the end of
the line.
If you're interested in any of this, take a look at the article "The
advantages of including leading (blank space above or below) in styles" on
page 176 of the following reference; "Leading above, or below, paragraphs?"
on page 177; and an article on "minimum maintenance formatting" in Appendix
A starting on page 164.
The reference is some notes on the way I use Word for the Mac, titled "Bend
Word to Your Will", which are available as a free download from the Word
MVPs' website (http://word.mvps.org/Mac/Bend/BendWordToYourWill.html).
[Note: "Bend Word to your will" is designed to be used electronically and
most subjects are self-contained dictionary-style entries. If you decide to
read more widely than the item I've referred to, it's important to read the
front end of the document -- especially pages 3 and 5 -- so you can select
some Word settings that will allow you to use the document effectively.]
Cheers,
Clive Huggan
Canberra, Australia
(My time zone is 5-11 hours different from North America and Europe, so my
follow-on responses to those regions can be delayed)
====================================================
> Follow the instructions Daiya sent you to in the post above yours :-)
>
>
> On 25/02/08 5:24 AM, in article ee8c915.25.TakeThisOut@webcrossing.caR9absDaxw, "John"
> <John> wrote:
>
>> Nothing helps me.
>>
>> Every time I hit enter, I get 1.5 spacing. Every time. HELP! >> Stay informed about: single line spacing |
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Since: Mar 11, 2008
Posts: 2
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(Msg. 29) Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 7:24 pm
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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I am trying to figure out mail merge. I miss the option to choose, for example, which names in an excel list to include. I have to make a whole different, edited excel list first? Sheesh.
Also, when I set it to make labels for my avery 8160, the space between lines is huge, even though the little box at the side says it's 1. The spaces between the three lines is so large that the whole address (name, street, city/state/zip - only three lines) barely fit on the label and the name is almost cut off at the top. It's legible but looks bad. How to change this?
Thanks so much for your time,
Debbie >> Stay informed about: single line spacing |
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External
Since: Mar 11, 2008
Posts: 2
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(Msg. 30) Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 7:32 pm
Post subject: Re: single line spacing [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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